How was Keenum allowed to play

[shaunpinney]

http://fox2now.com/2015/11/23/nfl-investigating-why-rams-qb-wasnt-tested-for-a-concussion/

NFL investigating why Rams QB wasn’t tested for a concussion

ST. LOUIS, MO (KTVI) - The NFL for the first time has given spotters the power to stop play to remove players from the field, who may have a concussion.

A play Sunday's brutal Rams loss to the Ravens has caused some serious questions to be raised about the NFL's concussion policy. With just over a minute to play Rams quarterback Case Keenum's head gets slammed to the ground. Keenum, who is clearly hurt, struggles to get up. He never came out of the game and two plays later fumbled to set up the Ravens game winning field goal

After the game the broadcasters on the FOX post-game show questioned what happened.

A reporter with the NFL Network says the league is looking into the situation. They are investigating why he wasn't tested for a concussion.

 

[sostl]

the worst part was, it was a free play. And only 2 of the dlineman actually keep playing. Cody Wichmann just stands there while barnes gets beat like a drum

 

[shaunpinney]

I've been hit in the head a lot while playing rugby, but only once I've ever been concussed after being kicked in the head while diving for a ball - and I passed the concussion protocols then - I played one of the best games of my career, but for 10days after, you could have told me I was Elvis' and Marilyn Monroe's love child and I would have agreed with you...

 

[iced]

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap30...-to-examine-situation-surrounding-case-keenum
NFL to examine situation surrounding Case Keenum

By Gregg Rosenthal , Around The NFL Editor , Published: Nov. 23, 2015 at 12:35 p.m.
Updated: Nov. 23, 2015 at 12:49 p.m.

The NFL will be looking into why St. Louis Rams quarterback Case Keenum was not tested for a possible concussion at the end of Sunday's loss to the Ravens, NFL Media Insider Ian Rapoport reported Monday.

Keenum's head was slammed to the turf on the Rams' final drive of the team's 16-13 loss to theBaltimore Ravens. He immediately held his head, and then struggled to stand up when a teammate helped him up. Keenum stayed on his knees, and backup quarterback Nick Foles began to warm up on the sideline.


Keenum then walked away from his teammates slowly, and then spoke with Rams trainer Reggie Scott. The game was briefly held up because of a penalty on the Ravens, but Keenum went back to the huddle and stayed in the game after the conversation. His next two plays were an incompletion, and then a lost fumble that ultimately cost the Rams the game.

The NFL started a new rule in 2015 in which a "spotter" employed at each game has the power to stop the game if they see any player struggling with a potential concussion.

"We don't expect this to happen a lot, but the athletic trainer is now empowered to stop the game if necessary to give the player the attention he needs," said Jeff Miller, the NFL's senior vice president of health and safety said in August. "Concussions and head and neck injuries are really important and they need immediate attention. Therefore that was going to predominate over any potential competitive concerns."

Rams coach Jeff Fisher, the league's Competition Committee chairman, seemed unaware of Keenum's concussion during his postgame press conference. He didn't mention the concussion, and he also alluded to getting Keenum a full week of practice.

"I'm gonna give Case a good week of practice," Fisher said after the game. "I expect him to do better than he did today. You can see he's mobile, he can move around, he can do things."

The St. Louis Post-Dispatch reported that a Rams official told the media 25 minutes after the game that Keenum couldn't speak with the media because he suffered a concussion. The team's website reported the concussion as well. The Rams told Around The NFLon Monday that Fisher will address the issue at his weekly press conference at 6 p.m. ET.

This figures to be an uncomfortable week for Fisher. The Post-Dispatch wondered aloud about Fisher's job security on Monday morning, and Bernie Miklasz of ESPN101 asked if Fisher could be fined. Keenum, surprisingly elevated to starter over Foles during the week, completed fewer than half of his passes on the way to 136 yards. The Rams blew a 10-point fourth quarter lead to a 2-7Ravens team.

Fisher called the loss "one of the hardest I've been around since I've been around here." Fisher, in his fourth season on the job, is 24-33 as Rams coach.

 

[Irish]

No link. Just something I was told by someone "close to the situation" from inside the locker room.

Take it for what it's worth.

But I see this to be a similar situation to the whole bridgewater fiasco. Such a hit but yet he was fine by Monday?

But the media milked the horrific nature of how serious the hit was. And once he was cleared the next day hardly a blip.

See, this is the problem with that line of thinking, though. Any hit that makes a player respond the way Keenum and Bridgewater did is a serious hit. CTE is a brutal disease that is born of repeated hits like the ones these two guys suffered. What's important is not that he was "fine" after the game, or on Monday. What matters is they were NOT fine immediately following. These guys need the coaches and the league to save them from themselves otherwise in 20 years they are going to be shooting themselves in the chest with a shotgun a la Junior Seau so that brain surgeons will be able to look at their brain in tact to understand how dire their situation really was.

This idea that there are varying degrees of concussions or "just getting your bell rung" is completely ridiculous in modern science. If a guy gets concussed, if a guy gets "flash" knocked out, or anything of the sort, he needs to be immediately removed from the game and put into a strict protocol that doesn't allow them to put their futures at risk.

Any concussion, regardless of degree, needs to be treated as a horrific event. Only when the NFL gets serious about concussions and brain trauma (lets call it what it is) will their players have a shot at having a moderately decent post-football life.

 

[CoachO]

See, this is the problem with that line of thinking, though. Any hit that makes a player respond the way Keenum and Bridgewater did is a serious hit. CTE is a brutal disease that is born of repeated hits like the ones these two guys suffered. What's important is not that he was "fine" after the game, or on Monday. What matters is they were NOT fine immediately following. These guys need the coaches and the league to save them from themselves otherwise in 20 years they are going to be shooting themselves in the chest with a shotgun a la Junior Seau so that brain surgeons will be able to look at their brain in tact to understand how dire their situation really was.

This idea that there are varying degrees of concussions or "just getting your bell rung" is completely ridiculous in modern science. If a guy gets concussed, if a guy gets "flash" knocked out, or anything of the sort, he needs to be immediately removed from the game and put into a strict protocol that doesn't allow them to put their futures at risk.

Any concussion, regardless of degree, needs to be treated as a horrific event. Only when the NFL gets serious about concussions and brain trauma (lets call it what it is) will their players have a shot at having a moderately decent post-football life.

I don't disagree with anyhing you said. You seem intent on shooting the messenger here.

All I was doing was passing along some information that isn't being reported in the media.

In almost every article I've seen in this its "a Rams staff member notified the media that Keenum would not be available" and they ran with that as if he indeed had a concussion. I've heard it was announced that he was undergoing concussion protocol which obviously must mean he has to have a concussion.

1+1 = 3 in this instance.

So please direct your soapbox somewhere else. You only saw what you saw on tv. None of us were there. He hit his head on the turf. Was disoriented for a few seconds. That doesn't automatically mean it was more than that.

Apparently this is just one more thing that is being added to the list of things that should cost Fisher his job. If that game turns out differently, my guess this isn't the national story that it's turning into. And the lynch mob remains at bay for another week.

 

[Irish]

I don't disagree with anyhing you said. You seem intent on shooting the messenger here.

All I was doing was passing along some information that isn't being reported in the media.

In almost every article I've seen in this its "a Rams staff member notified the media that Keenum would not be available" and they ran with that as if he indeed had a concussion. I've heard it was announced that he was undergoing concussion protocol which obviously must mean he has to have a concussion.

1+1 = 3 in this instance.

So please direct your soapbox somewhere else. You only saw what you saw on tv. None of us were there. He hit his head on the turf. Was disoriented for a few seconds. That doesn't automatically mean it was more than that.

Apparently this is just one more thing that is being added to the list of things that should cost Fisher his job. If that game turns out differently, my guess this isn't the national story that it's turning into. And the lynch mob remains at bay for another week.

I'm sorry. this is an issue I feel very passionately about. Definitely not calling anyone on this forum out, but definitely calling the NFL out whenever is appropriate.

As a youth football player who chose theater over football my Junior year, I quit because of concussions. Anecdotal, I know, but I suffered my third and final concussion on the practice field when some jerk thought "earholing" was an acceptable way to block. I only remember hearing the snap count, rounding the corner (I was DE) and waking up in the trainers room.

I am a 28 year old young man and I still have bouts of memory loss, wandering into a room and not remembering why I did it, and on more than one occasion I have left the oven on and went out to do something in the yard or on my car. I don't have definitive proof, but I have a sneaking suspicion that if I were to die today, if a doctor were to dissect my brain, they would find at the very least traces of, but most likely full blown CTE.

Again, this is completely anecdotal, but if some young kid from Missouri can get a traumatic brain disorder from less than 5 years of organized football, what must these professional athletes be going through when they get "disoriented" after slamming their head on the turf? It borders on tragic.

 

[Mojo Ram]

DOES HE OR DOES HE NOT HAVE A CONCUSSION?

I don't care if or when or by whom it was reported or not reported. Fucks sake.

 

[CoachO]

I'm sorry. this is an issue I feel very passionately about. Definitely not calling anyone on this forum out, but definitely calling the NFL out whenever is appropriate.

As a youth football player who chose theater over football my Junior year, I quit because of concussions. Anecdotal, I know, but I suffered my third and final concussion on the practice field when some jerk thought "earholing" was an acceptable way to block. I only remember hearing the snap count, rounding the corner (I was DE) and waking up in the trainers room.

I am a 28 year old young man and I still have bouts of memory loss, wandering into a room and not remembering why I did it, and on more than one occasion I have left the oven on and went out to do something in the yard or on my car. I don't have definitive proof, but I have a sneaking suspicion that if I were to die today, if a doctor were to dissect my brain, they would find at the very least traces of, but most likely full blown CTE.

Again, this is completely anecdotal, but if some young kid from Missouri can get a traumatic brain disorder from less than 5 years of organized football, what must these professional athletes be going through when they get "disoriented" after slamming their head on the turf? It borders on tragic.

I get it sympathize with your situation.

But not every hit to the head results in a life changing experience. I'm not in the least trying to minimize this. It something to be taken seriously. But IMO the league has gone overboard with feigned concern for player safety regarding concussions for one reason and one reason only. The lawsuit factor.

Trying to compare your circumstance as a youth player to someone who is among the best in their sport who are very well aware of the inherit risks of their chosen profession is an apples to oranges comparison.

 

[RamzFanz]

The NFL will be looking into why St. Louis Rams quarterback Case Keenum was not tested for a possible concussion at the end of Sunday's loss to the Ravens, NFL Media Insider Ian Rapoport reported Monday.

Keenum's head was slammed to the turf on the Rams' final drive of the team's 16-13 loss to theBaltimore Ravens. He immediately held his head, and then struggled to stand up when a teammate helped him up. Keenum stayed on his knees, and backup quarterback Nick Foles began to warm up on the sideline.

Keenum then walked away from his teammates slowly, and then spoke withRams trainer Reggie Scott. The game was briefly held up because of a penalty on the Ravens, but Keenum went back to the huddle and stayed in the game after the conversation. His next two plays were an incompletion, and then a lost fumble that ultimately cost the Rams the game.

The NFL started a new rule in 2015 in which a "spotter" employed at each game has the power to stop the game if they see any player struggling with a potential concussion.

In a statement released Monday, the league said, "Promptly after the conclusion of yesterday's game, we began a review to determine the facts of the injury to St. Louis quarterback Case Keenum and why he was not removed from the game for the necessary evaluation by a team physician or the unaffiliated neuro-trauma consultant as required by our concussion protocols. We are continuing that review today, which includes discussions with the Rams and their medical staff, the ATC spotter, the game officials, our medical advisors and the NFLPA. In the meantime, prior to this week's games, we will reinforce with all involved the need to ensure that these injuries are properly identified and addressed in a manner consistent with our protocols."

"We don't expect this to happen a lot, but the athletic trainer is now empowered to stop the game if necessary to give the player the attention he needs," said Jeff Miller, the NFL's senior vice president of health and safety said in August. "Concussions and head and neck injuries are really important and they need immediate attention. Therefore that was going to predominate over any potential competitive concerns."

NFLPA assistant executive director of external affairs George Atallah confirmed Monday that the NFLPA is reviewing the concussion protocol in the Keenum incident.

Rams coach Jeff Fisher, the league's Competition Committee chairman, seemed unaware of Keenum's concussion during his postgame press conference. He didn't mention the concussion, and he also alluded to getting Keenum a full week of practice.

"I'm gonna give Case a good week of practice," Fisher said after the game. "I expect him to do better than he did today. You can see he's mobile, he can move around, he can do things."

The St. Louis Post-Dispatch reported that a Rams official told the media 25 minutes after the game that Keenum couldn't speak with the media because he suffered a concussion. The team's website reported the concussion as well. The Rams told Around The NFL on Monday that Fisher will address the issue at his weekly press conference at 6 p.m. ET.

This figures to be an uncomfortable week for Fisher. The Post-Dispatch wondered aloud about Fisher's job security on Monday morning, and Bernie Miklasz of ESPN101 asked if Fisher could be fined. Keenum, surprisingly elevated to starter over Foles during the week, completed fewer than half of his passes on the way to 136 yards. The Rams blew a 10-point fourth quarter lead to a 2-7 Ravens team.

Fisher called the loss "one of the hardest I've been around since I've been around here." Fisher, in his fourth season on the job, is 24-33 as Rams coach.

 

[Rmfnlt]

Fisher is known as a player's coach, no? Shouldn't a player's coach be the first to jump in and prevent an EXTREMELY OBVIOUSLY CONCUSSED player from going back into the huddle?

Exactly what I was thinking... I can't imagine Fisher isn't watching every play intently.

I wonder how the players are processing the whole negligence thing on Fisher's part.

 

[Rmfnlt]

Concussed or not I don't see how proper concussion protocol was adhered to.

Yeah, garbage if you ask me.

No one... and I men no one, could have mistaken his behavior after that hit for anything other than a concussion.

There may have been camera shots over the years of a player acting worse, but I can't recall them (that's how long ago is would have been).

Whoever cleared him after administering the protocols should have their license revoked!

That man needs a full week of constant evaluation.

No, I'm not a doctor... I just happen to have two eyes and an ability to understand what I saw yesterday.

 

[Rmfnlt]

Take it for what it's worth.

I will.

 

[Rmfnlt]

No link. Just something I was told by someone "close to the situation" from inside the locker room.

Take it for what it's worth.

But I see this to be a similar situation to the whole bridgewater fiasco. Such a hit but yet he was fine by Monday?

But the media milked the horrific nature of how serious the hit was. And once he was cleared the next day hardly a blip.

Are you honestly trying to compare what Bridgewater looked like and what Keenan looked like?

 

[CoachO]

Are you honestly trying to compare what Bridgewater looked like and what Keenan looked like?

Not what I said at all. I guess you just read why you want to read.

What I said is the MEDIA COVERAGE of the situations are similar l. They tend to grandiose the situation. Makes for better headlines. Don't let the facts get in the way of a good story.

Find me one single media member who actually verified what was going on with Keenum after the game. You won't find one. They took the "word" of an intern who notified them that he wouldn't be available to the media and ran with it.

Now it's a national story with all the buzz being about the procedure and protocol rather than what really happened. Don't you find it interesting that not one single media report had discussed what they did? But there are "reports" all over the place about why what perceived to be done. Or not done.

 

[Rmfnlt]

I don't disagree with anyhing you said. You seem intent on shooting the messenger here.

All I was doing was passing along some information that isn't being reported in the media.

In almost every article I've seen in this its "a Rams staff member notified the media that Keenum would not be available" and they ran with that as if he indeed had a concussion. I've heard it was announced that he was undergoing concussion protocol which obviously must mean he has to have a concussion.

1+1 = 3 in this instance.

So please direct your soapbox somewhere else. You only saw what you saw on tv. None of us were there. He hit his head on the turf. Was disoriented for a few seconds. That doesn't automatically mean it was more than that.

Apparently this is just one more thing that is being added to the list of things that should cost Fisher his job. If that game turns out differently, my guess this isn't the national story that it's turning into. And the lynch mob remains at bay for another week.

And you have no links... so there's always that.

 

[kurtfaulk]

Fisher called the loss "one of the hardest I've been around since I've been around here." Fisher, in his fourth season on the job, is 24-33 as Rams coach.

He has plenty of losses to choose from with the Rams.

.

 

[Rmfnlt]

Not what I said at all. I guess you just read why you want to read.

What I said is the MEDIA COVERAGE of the situations are similar.

Concussions are serious things... IMO, they deserve prominent media coverage no matter what... if some facts change later, who gives a rats arse?

Not all of us are privy to insider information.

 

[Rmfnlt]

He has plenty of losses to choose from with the Rams.

.

This has been a very bad stretch of games for Fisher... yesterday's effort is almost indefensible from a coaching standpoint.

So, personally for him? It just might be one of the hardest losses... he's running out of excuses.

 

[CoachO]

Concussions are serious things... IMO, they deserve prominent media coverage no matter what... if some facts change later, who gives a rats arse?

Not all of us are privy to insider information.

You're missing the point I'm trying to make completely.

I've never once said that concussions aren't serious.

And what difference does it make at all in what we know or don't know? It doesn't change a thing either way. I get tired of the "public's right to know" bs that is now the standard. It's made accurate reporting nonexistent. In this age of social media and instant gratification it's more about being the first break the story with virtually no regard for accuracy.

And when it comes back and the story is completely flawed. They run and hide it in to the next headline without so much as acknowledgement of their "mistake". They claim things changed since their original report taking no accountability for the family members who read their crap.