Bill Belichick not a first-ballot Hall of Famer

[CanadaRam]

But what he did, how he cheated, affected the field of play. So yeah, his performance as a head coach involved cheating. Taping Rams Super Bowl Red Zone practice. Taping NY Jets signals. Deflating balls. And how many other things he did to circumvent the rules.

That is your opinion. I share that opinion. The NFL did not.
He took advantage of many loopholes that the NFL allowed, putting his team in the best position to win.

I absolutely do not agree on how the NFL handled the situation about taping Rams practice. But they allowed it.

 

[CanadaRam]

The guy had a great record.......with Brady, who made up for any coaching shortcomings (just like Stafford, who according to McVay "gets us out of a lot of bad calls"). Before the guy arrived and since the guy left BB hasn't done squat. 44-56 without Brady in New England; 36-44 with Cleveland; total 80-100. Impressive.

The Patriots won because of the combination of Brady and Belichick. On this topic, there could be real football debate between the 2 of us

 

[WestCoastRam]

Guy cheated. He's also one of the greatest coaches ever. He'll get in. This was done because it's really important to him to be a first ballot guy.

Kinda hilarious that someone followed the rules to screw him.

No big deal.

 

[CanadaRam]

On Rose and Bonds (two of three men you don't look up to); Rose had the most egregious crime, betting on baseball. The fact that when it happened in 1918, it almost killed baseball, is the reason it was so egregious. The sport had to be cleaned up. There were guys just like the White Sox like Hal Chase and others. But once they had that scandal, they decided those players would be banned for life and not eligible for the HOF. So Rose got what they got.

How much of Bonds performance was him and how much was the drugs? Oh sure, the argument is, prior to steroids he was probably the best player in baseball. I agree. So why did he have to cheat? Because he has an ego the size of Jupiter and he couldn't stand McGwire and Sosa getting more attention than the best player in baseball. So he swallowed his integrity and cheated. Without the drugs, how long would he have played and at what level? What would his numbers have really been? Certainly, not what they ended up being. Like I said, there were others before Bonds. We know who they were. And none of them are in the HOF, as it should be.

I'm less of a MLB fan than NFL.

For Rose, imo MLB made an example of him for his gambling. I understand. At least MLB made it clear that Rose was not allowed into the HF because MLB took a position on this. Even if my opinion differs, MLB took a stance and enforced it.

For Bonds, I agree. Great player who did not have to cheat. He did. His cheating directly impacted his performance. Like McGuire, Sosa and others.

 

[DragonOfBlood]

I fucking hate BB, Brady, the Patriots, their fans, Boston etc.

That being said, anyone who thinks BB isn’t a first ballot HoFer is a fool. And these whining media types are the same twats who kept Charles Haley out of the HoF for years because he was mean to them.

Ridiculous. The man has eight Super Bowl rings. That’s where the argument begins and ends.

 

[DragonOfBlood]

All of these cheating allegations have already carried the punishment in the form of fines, or covered up by the commissioner, thus not truly proven.

If these allegations are keeping the 2nd most winningest coach in NFL history out, it better keep Brady out too.

They won’t keep him out because the media have been firmly deepthroating that POS for decades.

Media types need to be replaced with former players and coaches as HoF voters in all sports.

 

[CanadaRam]

You keep fighting that fight that Rose should have been in the HOF, Bonds should be in the HOF and Belichick should have been a first ballot HOFer. I'll keep saying they got what they deserved....probably less than what they really deserved.

1) Rose was suspended. So he is not in the Hall of Fame. I actually have no problem with this. That said, his skills on the field were good enough to get him in, so if and when he is allowed to be considered for the HF, he should get in. His punishment by MLB having been completed.
2) Bonds should never get into the Hall of Fame.
3) The NFL knew what the Patriots did and said it was ok. The NFL is allowing votes on his merit. Belichick should get in.

4) In my opinion, the NFL should have addressed this when they found out in 2007, instead they destroyed the tapes. If the NFL had at the time, likely Belichick would be prevented from getting into the Hall of Fame.

 

[ReekofRams]

We know that Belichick was caught cheating. So how many times did he cheat and not get caught?

 

[WestCoastRam]

We know that Belichick was caught cheating. So how many times did he cheat and not get caught?

The rumors are crazy around the league: teams would double wipe down white boards, take their trash with them from hotels and at the facility when playing there, random guys hanging around team hotels and activities - and then there were all the headset malfunctions at Gilette amongst so many other things.

Here's the thing, he got caught cheating, Tom got caught cheating. And the most unreported story in the NFL was how the Pats funneled money to Brady to keep his salary low through his company and it's wellness work with players through Alex Gurerro.

There was a culture of cheating in that building. And what happens when there's a culture in a building?

 

[PARAM]

1) Rose was suspended. So he is not in the Hall of Fame. I actually have no problem with this. That said, his skills on the field were good enough to get him in, so if and when he is allowed to be considered for the HF, he should get in. His punishment by MLB having been completed.
2) Bonds should never get into the Hall of Fame.
3) The NFL knew what the Patriots did and said it was ok. The NFL is allowing votes on his merit. Belichick should get in.

4) In my opinion, the NFL should have addressed this when they found out in 2007, instead they destroyed the tapes. If the NFL had at the time, likely Belichick would be prevented from getting into the Hall of Fame.

Oh I believe Rose should be in the Hall of Famer, yesterday. As soon as he passed it was fine to put him in. His punishment was not being around to enjoy it.

I'm with you on Bonds.

And Belichick deserves to be in the HOF but his side antics and cheating are probably the reason he's not a first ballot HOFer. I'm okay with that.

 

[muggmeister]

It's bullshit that players have to wait 5 years to be considered, but, it should also apply to coaches and anybody else for inclusion. Yes, he fucking cheated. Caught a few times and the shit rolled off his back like it never happened. He will get in, but it better NOT be before Brady, who I hated as a player, too fucking good. Bellicheat did orchestra some great defenses in his career, with both the Pats and Giants as DC. I'm fine if he NEVER gets in but fuck everybody who is upset that he didnt get in immediately.

 

[PARAM]

I fucking hate BB, Brady, the Patriots, their fans, Boston etc.

That being said, anyone who thinks BB isn’t a first ballot HoFer is a fool. And these whining media types are the same twats who kept Charles Haley out of the HoF for years because he was mean to them.

Ridiculous. The man has eight Super Bowl rings. That’s where the argument begins and ends.

Pretty strong words there friend. He's done NOTHING without the GOAT QB. And with that QB, they played in the weakest division in football so they were guaranteed 5 or 6 wins every year. Plus he had to cheat multiple times to accomplish that. First ballot my ass.

The only player from any sport in recent memory who deserved a first ballot, unanimous HOF entry is Mariano Rivera.

On Haley, does he have three as a coach because he has 5 as a player.

 

[CanadaRam]

Pretty strong words there friend. He's done NOTHING without the GOAT QB. And with that QB, they played in the weakest division in football so they were guaranteed 5 or 6 wins every year. Plus he had to cheat multiple times to accomplish that. First ballot my ass.

The only player from any sport in recent memory who deserved a first ballot, unanimous HOF entry is Mariano Rivera.

On Haley, does he have three as a coach because he has 5 as a player.

Unfortunately in my opinion, February 3rd 2019, the Patriots won a Superbowl because of coaching above all else.

 

[muggmeister]

Unfortunately in my opinion, February 3rd 2019, the Patriots won a Superbowl because of coaching above all else.

I couldn't find a proper emoji to express how I agree with you and hate this at the same time...lol

 

[Memento]

Unfortunately in my opinion, February 3rd 2019, the Patriots won a Superbowl because of coaching above all else.

Two words: Fuck. That.

The fact that Belicheat found ways to cheat even after Spygate means that we cannot be certain that he didn't try to cheat during the Rams game. McVay wouldn't say that out loud; he's far too classy for that, but I guarantee you he had his eyes peeled for any nefarious activity, given their reputation.

Belicheat and Brady orchestrated not just one, but two different kinds of wholesale systematic cheating, which means it's very likely that he tried to find some way to cheat in that Super Bowl against McVay's Rams. If they did, it worked; they won, but I feel that every championship, every award, everything they've ever done should have a massive asterisk in front of it, and it should be questioned whether it was earned by fair or foul play.

He, Brady, and Kraft should never sniff the HOF. This is not just some Houston Astros thing, this is not just steroids; all of them participated in multiple forms of systematic cheating over a period of decades, and you don't come back from that, in my opinion.

 

[Mackeyser]

IDK, I loved Pete Rose I played baseball like Rose as every time I walked from Little League to Babe Ruth I always ran to first base, but I just have a feeling there was more to the story. Angelo Bartlett "Bart" Giamatti IMO was an honorable individual and that investigation practically drove Giamatti to his grave. Well, that and a few pack of Lucky Strikes a day, but there was quite a bit to that investigation they did not reveal.

I always thought Rose should be in the HOF, especially now with all the money MLB and other sports receive from gambling, but much like some basketball players not taking shots so the total goes under even though their team is ahead, maybe Pete never bet on his team to lose, but having money on your team to win affects your decisions in many ways. So for the Love of Pete, there might have been more to the story.

That’s what I’m saying, though. They had a forensic auditor go through and PROVE that Rose did absolutely nothing different when he bet and when he didn’t. No decisions were affected by the gambling.

That was paid for by the Commissioner’s office and it really negatively affected their case because they had been hoping it would make it so when they screwed Pete, they would be justified…but it didn’t so when they screwed him, it was Giamatti’s legacy with the next Commissioner to just continue the hate.

After everything, the argument that he affected the integrity of the game was proven false and now we have proof that gambling in and of itself (at least according to the leagues that are in league with organized and online gambling) doesn’t affect the integrity of the game. If it did, every major league would be admitting that it’s all theater and I don’t think they’re admitting that.