This is some BS

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HE WITH HORNS

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I know this is partially facetious but I kept waiting for the refs to signal Rams ball on the muffed punt. It looked like they just didn't want to and from what I saw, they never did until they announced the result of their meeting. How's that for conspiracy thinking? o_O

I was actually 100% serious about getting screwed by the refs every time we make a play.
 

Alan

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Stranger needing to provide further clarification:
Yes, the "selective and inconsistent enforcement" is the issue. And Yes, it's league wide.

One can argue it's random human error, or one can argue it's deliberate. Given the way the NFL has been run over the past 50+ years, I think it's more than obvious what the answer to that question is.
Do you mean selective or inconsistent or both? Cause if you're talking about inconsistent then I agree with you that it's been inconsistent for the last 50+ years. The refs have always been bad and it's just relatively recently that we've had the cameras to see it. If you're a bad ref then a large part of that is because you're inconsistent.

Instant replay has shown how often the refs are wrong in all the sports. With the new and more ambiguous rules their inconsistencies are really rearing their ugly heads. It's just a logical extension of the circumstances.

You can't blame it all on the refs though. Some of these new rules seem to have been written by some overseas service center. :LOL:

Be able to contest 3 penalties per game. Not ones that weren't called but ones that were.
 
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fearsomefour

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The penalty on the kick return was a terrible call but how it played out was as strange.
The ref stated that the ball would be spotted at the spot of the foul, the "hold" was at the Ram 30 and the ball was spotted at the Charger 40....nothin about that play makes sense.
 

Elmgrovegnome

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Yeah, it didn't take a score off the board and taking the extra time off the clock to get back to the red zone actually worked in their favor. The interception obviously killed it but if they'd worked it right, it would have been a perfect way to seal the game.

That could go either way. If they get th ball at the ten then three runs to run off time and a field goal, then let the D try to hold them. The defense had a nice series just before that punt and would have been pumped if the Rams had scored.
 

A.J. Hicks

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I have to agree.
Whenever the Rams make a great play I don't celebrate, I look for flags.
Taking the fun out of the game for me.


Imagine how Tavon Austin must feel. . . Seems like every time he really gets going. Doesn't have to be a TD just gets going and makes some bit of play. . . called back - penalty somewhere, someone in section 108 spilled their beer. He may even have troubles just sprinting as a workout thinking he may get a penalty thrown.
 

Stranger

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Do you mean selective or inconsistent or both? Cause if you're talking about inconsistent then I agree with you that it's been inconsistent for the last 50+ years. The refs have always been bad and it's just relatively recently that we've had the cameras to see it. If you're a bad ref then a large part of that is because you're inconsistent.

Instant replay has shown how often the refs are wrong in all the sports. With the new and more ambiguous rules their inconsistencies are really rearing their ugly heads. It's just a logical extension of the circumstances.

You can't blame it all on the refs though. Some of these new rules seem to have been written by some overseas service center. :LOL:

Be able to contest 3 penalties per game. Not ones that weren't called but ones that were.
Complicated Rulebook with excessive quantity of rules + bad, corrupt or poorly trained refs = high failure rate (or, much noise in the signal). High failure rates creates greater opportunity for game-outcome bias with lesser degree of detection.

Ultimately, it's a sophisticated system, but it's still discover-able. If we start accurately recording data in a DB, and analyzing patterns, then the bias will be revealed in hard data that's irrefuteable. But this kind of transparency will never ever occur, except via some independent group which is well & independently funded. And even if it did, the Goodhell's of the world will just spin their way out of it [perhaps, with a "study"].

Yeah, yeah, I know, the majority on this board says I'm full of it. But, well, they are wrong.
 

Robocop

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Hello, Bolts fan here. As a Charger backer, I have to agree that the calls yesterday were downright embarrassing. Rams fans definitely have a legitimate gripe.

The interesting pattern I've noticed over many years is that there is at least one game (sometimes two) per year where a NON 'media darling' team gets an egregious, jaw dropping hose job from the refs - I.e. like unbelievably bad, WTF type calls that seem to occur at critical junctures, particularly when your team is mounting a strong charge or clutch comeback. You'll sometimes notice a series of calls that almost make it obvious that the refs are determined to preserve a pre-arranged outcome. The Chargers had their ref-job game earlier this year in Denver vs the league's anointed ambassador, Peyton Manning. Last year, it was in DC (prior to RG3 & co self destructing). Year before, Drew Brees record setting night in New Orleans.

I'm also not blinded enough by homerism to ignore the one or two instances per year that inexplicably tilt a game in our favor (just like yesterday). I guess you could forget it all & just chalk it up to the idea that 'it all balances out in the end'. But being a supporter of fair play, none of this sits very well with me. Now I don't pay close attention to Rams games, other than cursory glances given by ESPN updates, but I imagine that if y'all jog your memory, you might notice a similar pattern. Heck, I can't imagine Tom Brady's bogus 1st ring vs the Greatest Show on Turf brings out warm & fuzzy feelings among your faithful. And btw, I previously theorized one or two 'ref job' games per year because it seems that any more than that would elicit a much stronger response from a increasingly suspicious audience, inviting unwanted extra scrutiny. Keep it to just one game per year & you've got some manageable expectations for plausible deniability - especially since you have a built-in group of 'debunkers' in the form of opposing fans.

Anyways, just thought I'd seek the opinion of other fans. Yes, I'm well aware that what I'm suggesting will draw some charges of being a tinfoil wearing hat conspiracy kook. Fair enough. But I do know that I'm a rational, educated person who's capable of deducing from some fairly overwhelming visual evidence I've been witness to over the years.

I apologize in advance for muddying the waters or ruffling any feathers.

'DJ'
appreciate it. that was the same ref from our Dallas game we went up 21-0 against and lost. it was just as bad. our DE sacked Romo in the end zone and is called for holding against Witten afterward. same refs... Dallas is a huge market team so you make sure the game goes as planned
 

Mojo Ram

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I'm starting to think coaches should be allowed to challenge a penalty. With the increasing technology, any call is under much more scrutiny and failures more easily identifiable. It was probably always there, but now, it's much more easily caught and is making the refs look increasingly bad. We have replay to correct calls related to plays and players, why not expand to penalties as well, they certainly can be a turning point in a game. I'm not looking to increase the number of challenges, just expand the scope where they can be used.
This was my thought too. Coaches have a few red flags already. Let them throw them and challenge a penalty. Pick up the penalty flag if it was an obvious mistake/no call situation.
Try it in preseason...something. Send the replay to the home office.
 

Mojo Ram

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Also, those two hands to the face penalties are technically correct. But they were not risking player safety and were about the quickest flags I've ever seen for that violation. If a player is grabbing a face mask or sticking his hand into it, definitely. But an errant hand being pulled away immediately? That call is bad for the game - period.
Yep. That's called incidental contact, similar to the NBA when two opposing players are going for a loose basketball and there is contact made. If one of the players uses obvious, excessive physicality against the other player in order to gain advantage in getting possession...thats a loose ball foul. Fine.
Sometimes however, two guys going for one ball will force both guys to make contact with each other(without intent to shove, trip or knock the other guy down). Thats incidental contact and should be a no-call.

Like facemasking in football. Sometimes a hand hits, or brushes across a facemask. Shit happens. If the player gets it away quickly and there's no obvious "intent" then it should be a no-call.

WAY too many flags(NFL) and whistles(in the NBA) are being called. These refs are using no judgement whatsoever IMO.
A no-call in sports is a part of refereeing. Let them play.
 

DR RAM

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This was my thought too. Coaches have a few red flags already. Let them throw them and challenge a penalty. Pick up the penalty flag if it was an obvious mistake/no call situation.
Try it in preseason...something. Send the replay to the home office.
You mean take away the cheating....yeah, that will happen. LOL.
 

DaveFan'51

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I honestly think the ref saw the SD player hit his own guy in the back and thought it was the Rams player. Still not a good excuse but otherwise the ref was calling something he thought might happen. In the end? Another bullcrap call and something needs to be done about these refs. Stop throwing flags just to be an influence on the game. I keep saying it but it just keeps getting worse. NO ONE IS WATCHING THESE GAMES TO SEE YOU ZEBRAS!!! Get that through your freaking heads!
Pre-game one of the announcers mention that this crew of Ref's, throws more flags, per game, on average, than any other crew! I wonder if he was trying to warn us!?! ( League average, coming into this game was 16 Penalty Flags, this crew's average is 18!) They showed their stuff in this game!!
 

Stranger

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appreciate it. that was the same ref from our Dallas game we went up 21-0 against and lost. it was just as bad. our DE sacked Romo in the end zone and is called for holding against Witten afterward. same refs... Dallas is a huge market team so you make sure the game goes as planned
random data point
 

Jumava1968

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If the Rams make a big play, it's up to the refs to make up a penalty. Haven't you guys been watching this season?
Exactly these calls were as bad as the Dallas game.And does anyone else notice that ESPN and other news outlets downplay these bad calls as if made no difference in the outcome.The Dallas game for example bad calls to the end,but all they had to say was how Dallas came back from behind to win.
 

Alan

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Stranger with this:
"Complicated Rule book with excessive quantity of rules + bad, corrupt or poorly trained refs = high failure rate (or, much noise in the signal). High failure rates creates greater opportunity for game-outcome bias with lesser degree of detection.

You need to reduce the hyperbole (the corrupt reference) until you get some evidence. I don't follow/agree with your contention that the detection rates can be affected by the amount or complexity of the rules. I'm not following your logic there. Increased complexity will just lead to more inconsistency in the interpretation and thus the enforcement will be even more uneven. The increased quantity will mean that while they may see multiple infractions they will only call the one they think is the most important and let the others slide. At least that's how I see it.

Ultimately, it's a sophisticated system, but it's still discover-able. If we start accurately recording data in a DB, and analyzing patterns, then the bias will be revealed in hard data that's irrefutable. But this kind of transparency will never ever occur, except via some independent group which is well & independently funded. And even if it did, the Goodhell's of the world will just spin their way out of it [perhaps, with a "study"].

Paranoia aside, you might indeed find a pattern were you to collate all the data you're talking about but what are you most likely to find? I would conjecture that you'd discover that certain refs suck much more than others. After all, not all the refs are incompetent and the data should show that some refs (the incompetent ones) are wildly inconsistent and others (the better refs) are much more consistent.

The NFL (or the officials union, doesn't matter which) knows which refs are the better ones and that's why they are picked to officiate in the playoff games with the cream of the crop getting the SB. You can look at that in two ways IMO.

The first way is the "They're out to get us" theory advanced by the little kid in the video. ;) That's where the NFL decides to have the crappy officials officiate at the Rams games because they hate them and they want them to lose.

The second way to look at it is the "Were on national TV so we need to look good" theory. That's where the NFL assigns the best crews to the games they think will be the most important (and most watched). Those games would rarely include the Rams would they? :( :LOL:

Since one of them involves increasing revenue and the other only involves some perceived slight, guess which one I'm going with?


Yeah, yeah, I know, the majority on this board says I'm full of it. But, well, they are wrong.

I'm also frequently out on a limb by myself on this board and just like you, I'm always right too. There are so many, to paraphrase Spiro Agnew, nattering nabobs of positivity on this board I just mostly ignore them. :palm: :ROFLMAO:"

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PN6xx_V6Ims
Or, you could be right. About everything. :cautious:
 
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junkman

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Exactly these calls were as bad as the Dallas game.And does anyone else notice that ESPN and other news outlets downplay these bad calls as if made no difference in the outcome.The Dallas game for example bad calls to the end,but all they had to say was how Dallas came back from behind to win.

I'm still upset about the lack of a call on that play where Langford had a free run at Romo and was literally tackled from behind, just as Romo launched a bomb to ... Bryant perhaps?
 

Jumava1968

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I'm still upset about the lack of a call on that play where Langford had a free run at Romo and was literally tackled from behind, just as Romo launched a bomb to ... Bryant perhaps?
That was a bad call and the sack on Romo taken away because of the bad holding call on Sims was even worse.I keep hearing well the refs will stop doing that to our Rams when we start winning more.But how are we going to win more if the refs won't let us,is what I'd like to know.
 

Jumava1968

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This was my thought too. Coaches have a few red flags already. Let them throw them and challenge a penalty. Pick up the penalty flag if it was an obvious mistake/no call situation.
Try it in preseason...something. Send the replay to the home office.
We would have a winning record and playing for a playoff spot if that was something we were able to do already.