T.J. McDonald carving his own path/Wagoner

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RamBill

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T.J. McDonald carving his own path
By Nick Wagoner

http://espn.go.com/blog/st-louis-rams/post/_/id/13890/t-j-mcdonald-carving-his-own-path

EARTH CITY, Mo. -- The recent ascent of the St. Louis Rams' defense has been expected if not overdue. But it's no coincidence it has taken off in recent weeks at the same time some of its young cornerstones have begun coming into their own.

Perhaps none of those young players has made more strides over the past three weeks or so than safety T.J. McDonald.

Sometimes, that has meant putting up impressive numbers as he did two weeks ago against Arizona with nine tackles and a sack. Sometimes, it's more about the physical presence he provides, such as last week against Denver when he had five tackles and two pass breakups, but ensured that Denver pass-catchers would feel every bit of them.

On a defense loaded with more familiar names like end Robert Quinn, linebackers James Laurinaitis and Alec Ogletree, and defensive tackle Aaron Donald, it's McDonald's performance from the safety spot that has elevated the Rams' defense into one of the league's best over the past three weeks.

"It’s just been tremendous growth, especially this whole season and the past few weeks in particular," fellow safety Rodney McLeod said. "The guy is showing up in every phase, whether it’s special teams and on defense, tackling, pass-breakups. We’ve got to work on his hands a little bit, but other than that, the guy has been doing a great job for us. It’s just great to see him making plays back there at a time like this when we are trying to make a push for the playoffs and we need everybody to step up and make plays for us."

In many ways, McDonald's play has been what was expected when the Rams used a third-round choice on him in the 2013 NFL draft. McDonald quickly claimed a starting spot and earned praise for how fast he was able to pick up the system. A fracture in his leg limited him to 10 games as a rookie with mixed results.

But when the Rams hired defensive coordinator Gregg Williams in the offseason, many believed McDonald was a perfect safety for his system. At 6-foot-2, 217 pounds, McDonald is the prototype of a Williams safety who can be a force near the line of scrimmage offering an additional hammer in the run game with emerging blitz skills. That McDonald wasn't known for his coverage abilities didn't figure to matter given Williams' propensity for playing with a lot of single-high safety looks, a look that would generally feature McLeod on the back end.

True to that idea, McDonald spent much of the early part of the season near the line of scrimmage, defending the run and bringing the blitz. Through the Rams' first eight games, McDonald had almost an identical split in snaps played in the run box (230) and snaps played on the back end (221).

What's interesting, though, is how much more McDonald has been asked to do in coverage over the past three weeks. Although that lines up with the arrival of Mark Barron via trade, Barron has only been heavily involved in one of those games.

According to Pro Football Focus' metrics, McDonald has played 144 of his 209 snaps over the past three weeks in coverage, which works out to about 69 percent. For what it's worth, McDonald has earned his highest grades in coverage from PFF over that same span.

"I feel like I am recognizing things faster and I am more comfortable in the defense," McDonald said. "I feel like I’m on my toes and playing downhill and having a lot of fun playing.

"I think just like any new defense, anything that’s new, you have got to understand what your job is, and that was the first thing. Everybody was trying to make sure they did their job. I felt like we got a good grip on what our coaches want from us. Then it becomes 'what is the offense going to do?' Then we put that stuff together and really focus on what is going on with them."

Against the Broncos, quarterback Peyton Manning targeted McDonald seven times and came away with three completions for just 6 yards with a long of 3 yards. Even on those rare completions, McDonald was quick to lower the boom and finished with a pair of pass-breakups.

It was the type of performance that left many making the seemingly endless and easy comparisons to his father, former six-time All Pro safety Tim McDonald. But as McDonald continues to string together solid performances, maybe it's time to start letting what he does on the field stand on its own.

"I have definitely walked in his shadow for a long time," McDonald said. "I can’t say I’ve been trying to stray away from that, but at the same time you want to be your own man and you definitely want to be known as, I want people to one day be able to say 'That’s T.J.’s dad' not 'I’m Tim’s son.' I have a long ways to go. I’m in no rush, I’m just trying to get better, have fun and play ball."
 

ztoben

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Rated one of the best safeties in the league over the past three weeks by pff, and only looks like he will continue to flourish in this defense. I believe fisher when he said that TJ will be the best safety drafted in his class. The kid has been playing phenominal, and really coming into his own.
 

RamFan503

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What's interesting, though, is how much more McDonald has been asked to do in coverage over the past three weeks. Although that lines up with the arrival of Mark Barron via trade, Barron has only been heavily involved in one of those games.

According to Pro Football Focus' metrics, McDonald has played 144 of his 209 snaps over the past three weeks in coverage, which works out to about 69 percent. For what it's worth, McDonald has earned his highest grades in coverage from PFF over that same span.

"I feel like I am recognizing things faster and I am more comfortable in the defense," McDonald said. "I feel like I’m on my toes and playing downhill and having a lot of fun playing.

"I think just like any new defense, anything that’s new, you have got to understand what your job is, and that was the first thing. Everybody was trying to make sure they did their job. I felt like we got a good grip on what our coaches want from us. Then it becomes 'what is the offense going to do?' Then we put that stuff together and really focus on what is going on with them."

Against the Broncos, quarterback Peyton Manning targeted McDonald seven times and came away with three completions for just 6 yards with a long of 3 yards. Even on those rare completions, McDonald was quick to lower the boom and finished with a pair of pass-breakups.

@Alan Ahem! :whistle: :D :shades:
 

Alan

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RamFan503 demonstrating that we have a failure to communicate:
@AlanAhem! :whistle: :D :shades:

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V2f-MZ2HRHQ

I have never said he couldn't cover people. I think he's pretty good at it. What I said is that he can't play centerfield. JJ can cover people really well in man-to-man but often fails miserably in any zone scheme.

Let me reiterate, McDonald can't play centerfield but he is good in other coverage schemes.

While opposing TEs have often eaten our lunch in games and McD, thank Bhudda, has been able to mitigate that lately, although whoever was covering Witten did a poor job, it isn't the area of my greatest concern. That problem can only be addressed by someone with FS skills. Skills that I haven't seen him demonstrate up to now. Of course that's probably because they stopped having him do that after his many prior failures. maybe he'll learn to do that but I think playing him at SS takes the best advantage of his skill set. Which I like very much BTW.
 

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Well, given that we have Barron and a big/physical 4th round safety project on the depth chart, I think it's possible that next year we see Williams toying with TJM rotating into McLeod's spot in the deep middle and/or McLeod being relegated to more package work than he is now.

One thing that is clearly going on now with Williams in charge is great coaching. These guys are playing good ball, with good technique, as a unit and it's starting to really show on the field. When you consider the talent they have in the secondary (which is profound in my estimation, from CB to Safety) and the coaching they're getting, I wouldn't assume that playing deep middle is beyond TJM's ability.

Can you imagine that dude coming across at nearly 220lbs and taking out receivers deep? It may happen at some point as he settles into this scheme and continues to be coached up.
 

ReddingRam

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Well, given that we have Barron and a big/physical 4th round safety project on the depth chart, I think it's possible that next year we see Williams toying with TJM rotating into McLeod's spot in the deep middle and/or McLeod being relegated to more package work than he is now.

One thing that is clearly going on now with Williams in charge is great coaching. These guys are playing good ball, with good technique, as a unit and it's starting to really show on the field. When you consider the talent they have in the secondary (which is profound in my estimation, from CB to Safety) and the coaching they're getting, I wouldn't assume that playing deep middle is beyond TJM's ability.

Can you imagine that dude coming across at nearly 220lbs and taking out receivers deep? It may happen at some point as he settles into this scheme and continues to be coached up.
I also think they might want to consider making Mo Alexander back into what he really was in college ... an OLB. He has the frame to add a few more pounds and his athleticism would be off the charts like Tree.
 

RamFan503

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No I get what you are saying and I am mostly just messin' with yuh.

Now this IS something I take exception to.
Of course that's probably because they stopped having him do that after his many prior failures.
You keep mentioning him failing at playing center field. Where are you getting this? Just because they don't put him at deep middle doesn't mean he can't do it. It is more that it would be a waste of his abilities as BOTH a good cover safety and very good in run support and the short passing game they feel will be used extensively against them with our D-line. McD played FS his sophomore and junior years at USC and received accolades in bunches for it. When has he ever failed at it? Never?

Don't be surprised if he gets asked to do it more with the Rams now with Barron coming in.
 

LACHAMP46

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I'm a TJ guy....I Believe like 503 he can do it all....He played FS as a Freshman & Sophomore....I thought he did great....
Rated one of the best safeties in the league over the past three weeks by pff, and only looks like he will continue to flourish in this defense. I believe fisher when he said that TJ will be the best safety drafted in his class. The kid has been playing phenominal, and really coming into his own.
I really liked that safety class too...I wished we had gotten 2 of them but with Barron & Mo Alexander I feel we should have that area covered....It's good to see a kid start to take off that you know plays the game the right way...Hard.
 

Alan

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RamFan503 going over old ground just to pull my chain:
You keep mentioning him failing at playing center field. Where are you getting this?

Just because they don't put him at deep middle doesn't mean he can't do it. It is more that it would be a waste of his abilities as BOTH a good cover safety and very good in run support and the short passing game they feel will be used extensively against them with our D-line

McD played FS his sophomore and junior years at USC and received accolades in bunches for it. When has he ever failed at it? Never?
They occasional used him in that role last year when they were actually pretending that there was no difference between FS and SS in Fisher's system.

So we agree what the role he should be playing is. (y)

Also, and I know you have a different view on this, all the times he was asked to do that in college would be the other examples I was talking about. So for me, his history at playing that role isn't a good one. He may have received accolades from many about his performance but none of them were from me so I consider them interesting but ultimately, meaningless. His performance in that role was also panned by many which I've pointed out to you in the past. A fact which seems to continually slip your mind or, like me, you didn't believe my experts on him because it didn't jibe with your experts and/or what you saw yourself. ;) That's why these things are called opinions and not facts.

And yes, I know you were mainly just messin' with me which is fine because I like talking with you about this. And being messed with. :LOL: You know how much I love it when others disagree with me. :banana:

Nothing this organization did would surprise me and while I'm not at all happy with his abilities in this area, can he be any worse than McLeod? I pretty much assume the other team will score a TD every game due to this problem and I've rarely been wrong when doing so. Unfortunately. :(

Depending on how FA and the draft plays out next year we may indeed be forced to have McD play center field. Maybe he'll get better at it. :unsure: :cautious:
 

RamFan503

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Also, and I know you have a different view on this, all the times he was asked to do that in college would be the other examples I was talking about. So for me, his history at playing that role isn't a good one. He may have received accolades from many about his performance but none of them were from me so I consider them interesting but ultimately, meaningless. His performance in that role was also panned by many which I've pointed out to you in the past. A fact which seems to continually slip your mind or, like me, you didn't believe my experts on him because it didn't jibe with your experts and/or what you saw yourself. ;) That's why these things are called opinions and not facts.

But you see -there is nothing to back this up. He never failed at the FS position. When he was moved to a hybrid SS/LB position in Kiffen's ill fated defensive scheme, he had some issues and that is what the mainly east coast draft gurus glommed onto. A system BTW in which he was rarely if EVER asked to play deep center field.

I watched him play a lot. The guy was a very good FS when asked to ACTUALLY play FS. I just don't buy that you paid much attention to him during his sophomore and junior years at USC. You are one of the East Coasters right? And we KNOW how much you guys know about Pac 12 players. :rolleyes:

:D
 

Alan

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RamFan503 in denial:
But you see -there is nothing to back this up.
Just because you haven't seen or don't remember the stuff that backs it up doesn't mean it doesn't exist you know. I've explained to you that I've read reports on him that panned him for that. I posted some of them here when we first drafted him. I also mentioned that I saw him in action last year where he did have those responsibilities and he failed.

So the rest of your post just reiterated what you've said before. I understand your position, I just disagree with it.

But of course I hope you're right about this. :)
 

RamFan503

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Just because you haven't seen or don't remember the stuff that backs it up doesn't mean it doesn't exist you know. I've explained to you that I've read reports on him that panned him for that. I posted some of them here when we first drafted him. I also mentioned that I saw him in action last year where he did have those responsibilities and he failed.

So the rest of your post just reiterated what you've said before. I understand your position, I just disagree with it.

But of course I hope you're right about this. :)

When did he ever get asked to play deep safety with us? When someone else missed an assignment? I don't remember him being asked to do that. Maybe I missed it but I don't think so. But you never did like this pick so I don't think you are basing anything on him actually failing at FS as a Ram. I remember me and Doc trying to explain to you what he was being asked to do his senior year and how that didn't give an honest assessment of his abilities in deep coverage.

Find anything beyond what a few draftniks said that were commenting based on his senior year "difficulties". I challenged their assertions then based entirely on watching him play. I said it in the mocks and said it after we drafted him. He was a steal where we picked him as he can play either safety position. I haven't taken this line on any other player. It's just that I watched him play so much. And frankly it was irritating then reading those assessments as he was probably the brightest star on that entire defense.

When people comment on Mo and other players they have watched play, I don't pretend to have seen what they have seen. But I HAVE watched a lot of McD. The kid excelled at virtually everything he was asked to do. And he even excelled at what the draftniks panned him for. He wasn't being asked to cover deep or be put on speedy receivers. He was being asked to roam the middle and sidelines in a role he'd never played. And still I believe he led the team in tackles and had several passes defensed to go along with some INTs and forced fumbles.

I'm not irritated with you BTW. I realize you just don't know any better. :D:p And you don't have to hope I'm right about this one. McD will show you himself if he's asked to do it.
 

Alan

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RamFan503 with his last dying breath:
But you never did like this pick so I don't think you are basing anything on him actually failing at FS as a Ram.

I challenged their assertions then based entirely on watching him play. I said it in the mocks and said it after we drafted him. He was a steal where we picked him as he can play either safety position.

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lvLu7l_ZUJY


I'm going to flop around on the deck one final time on this subject before I get filleted.

Your first point is always something I have to watch out for and it's why I've only dipped my toes in the water in the Schotty, GW and Fisher threads because I didn't like any of them before we hired them. Although I was ambivalent concerning Schotty. So you're right, I am biased concerning McD but as I have no vested interest in being right (it's the debate that interests me) I don't think that's the motivating factor in my reasoning. Especially considering that I was unimpressed with his whole skill set and I've since made an about face concerning how I feel about his play as a SS. But there's always that chance that I've let my pre-existing bias influence my view or maybe partially influence my view.

You seem to have inadvertently introduced and partially validated my last point about not only McD but how he was viewed by the rest of the teams. When you say that he was a steal where we picked him in the third round, what does that say that all the other teams weren't very high on him either? Not only that, as I pointed out at the time, most of the draft sites had him slotted to be picked in the 4th round. It seems as if most of the NFL agreed with me too. Something I've already said before too.

As I said, you listened to other experts and disagreed with their assessment of him. Exactly as I'm doing with your assessment and yet my disagreement is based on my personal bias and yours is not? :LOL:
upload_2014-11-21_7-4-21.jpeg


View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TlB592l8SZ4
 
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SteveBrown

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He is looking like pro bowl level player- I didn't expect that, he looked limited in his movement....but I know no thing--you can't know how a guy will use his mind to become great.
I hope Tavon is learning a lesson from this guy. I still beleive in tavon, but it looks like Schooty doesn't.
 

RamFan503

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You seem to have inadvertently introduced and partially validated my last point about not only McD but how he was viewed by the rest of the teams. When you say that he was a steal where we picked him in the third round, what does that say that all the other teams weren't very high on him either? Not only that, as I pointed out at the time, most of the draft sites had him slotted to be picked in the 4th round. It seems as if most of the NFL agreed with me too. Something I've already said before too.

That was my point. Often draftniks do the same research as other teams scouting departments. If a player does something his senior year, most of them write him off or drop him on their boards if it's not viewed as a positive. In this case, it was Kiffen who did something to McD and that something was having him play a position that not only is not a starting role in the NFL but that put him in a real tweener type position. In order for someone to value him highly, they would have had to have been interested in him before that senior year and followed his body of work. Fish is a USC guy. So unlike many others out there, he was no doubt in tune with what kind of player was McD before the gawd awful Kiffin experience.

And what has happened? He has done everything he has been asked. And contrary to what you have said, he has not FAILED at playing deep safety or anything else since he came here. He simply hasn't been asked to do it as he has other strengths that are better utilized given our personnel. But if he does get asked to play deep safety or FS or anything else realistically in his wheelhouse, he will do just fine. And he will still bring the wood to the campfire.
 

Alan

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RamFan503 loving draftniks:
And contrary to what you have said, he has not FAILED at playing deep safety or anything else since he came here. He simply hasn't been asked to do it as he has other strengths that are better utilized given our personnel. But if he does get asked to play deep safety or FS or anything else realistically in his wheelhouse, he will do just fine. And he will still bring the wood to the campfire.
But it's my contention that not only has he been asked but when asked he has failed. Not this year maybe but last year for sure. I'll leave it up to our fellow posters to weigh in on this because I'm sure their memories are far superior to yours. I'll be sending my special Thanksgiving Day fruitcakes to any posters that don't remember this like I do so keep that in mind.

As for the herd like behavior of the draftniks that you hang out with, are you contending that the teams GMs are like Oxpeckers who feed exclusively on the backs of the larger draftniks, unable to come to their own conclusions like you and I? Or did his name get lost in some kind of paperwork snafu during the draft and that's why he wasn't picked until the third round? ;)

Here's a picture of several GMs perched on the back of Mel Kiper:
images
 

blackbart

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Really happy to see him coming on. I liked the pick and with Fisher calling the shots I knew he would develop in to a nice pro. This is the defense I thought we'd have from the start of the year, I can't wait to see how badass they are next year.
 

RamFan503

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But it's my contention that not only has he been asked but when asked he has failed. Not this year maybe but last year for sure. I'll leave it up to our fellow posters to weigh in on this because I'm sure their memories are far superior to yours. I'll be sending my special Thanksgiving Day fruitcakes to any posters that don't remember this like I do so keep that in mind.

Guess we'll see. I'd like to know if anyone recalls him being asked to play deep safety and failing at it. I'm not even saying it is beyond the realm of possibilities for a rookie to have been beat in coverage on occasion. Is that your definition of failure? Oh the horror!

As for the herd like behavior of the draftniks that you hang out with, are you contending that the teams GMs are like Oxpeckers who feed exclusively on the backs of the larger draftniks, unable to come to their own conclusions like you and I? Or did his name get lost in some kind of paperwork snafu during the draft and that's why he wasn't picked until the third round? ;)

Didn't say anything about herd like behavior. Just that many people from draftniks to scouts have similar behavior patterns. Granted, NFL scouts are paid for looking deeper than talking heads like that stooge Kiper but they still only have so much time and not everyone falls on their radar. Whereas, Fish is a USC alum. He was born and raised in Southern Cal. He is going to follow his alma matre much more closely than many others. McD's dad was a USC alum. Fisher and McD senior are friends. He is going to know WAY more about McD Jr than probably any other coach, scout, draftnik, etc. He is also going to have a real good idea of who has been keeping tabs on McD and where he might go in the draft.

This is why I say that while other scouts, coaches, and draftniks dropped McD on their board, Fish knew more about him and snagged him where he knew he could and before another coach was likely waiting, licking his chops.

BTW - when McD delivered that bone jarring hit against Denver, he was apparently playing deep safety unless he was just out of position.