Past QB question

[FrantikRam]

I agree with you about the union people. I have never been a union advocate because it breeds the same laziness that I complain about. The thing is Unions don't and never did dominate the workforce around my area. There are two main union forces here. And one has always stayed in check, the other was recently reorganized.

Your reply makes it sound as though everyone from my generation was unionized. That is not the case. I figured some people would take personal offense to my comments, but that is not my fault if you feel the need to defend your generation. Just know that I am not targetting you personally. If you own a business then I am sure you know what hard work is all about. In the Dept of Labor and industry we were always looked to help solve labor issues and the entitled employees that don't work was always the biggest problem and my bosses that had worked in the Dept for 30+ years have always referred to it as a new problem or a worsening one.

I know from my personal experience that I preferred to higher people that were older. They knew how to earn their money. Hiring and firing is not productive. So I favored a more mature responsible person.

I don't own a company, just ascended quickly to manage my department. Over and around much older people I might add.

I was just refuting your claim about younger people being generally more lazy and entitled....I've encountered that in just as many "older" people as I have "younger". But either way, at the end of the day people will do what you allow them to do.

And as Jrry alluded to, this is a learned behavior. Parenting is a form of leadership, and just like leadership in the work place, not all who take it on are qualified to do so. That leads to all kinds of issues.

When I came in to a leadership role in my department, there was one person younger than 30 years old. She ended up finding another job. The other 14 or so people? All either terminated or encouraged to find another job (legally of course). They were all over 40 years old, and they were all entitled/lazy - but I don't fault them for that. They had horrific leadership for YEARS.

 

[Warner4Prez]

Wow, this one spiraled out of control fairly quickly!

As to the question at hand, I'm not sure there are many QB's with questionable characters that succeed, simply because they aren't given the chance. That's a tough black mark to overcome, especially in the last 5-10 years with the heightened attention to the league and it's stars. Not sure if there was a bad wrap about guys like Cutler or Stafford coming out of school, but as pros I believe they've both been labeled as bad locker room attitudes at best, cancerous at worst.

The flip side though is look at some of the 'good guys' that have flamed out too: Ponder, Tebow, McCoy even our own Sam Bradford (though I'd stop short of declaring he's flamed out). I think regardless of the players' behavior, it's more where they end up and the situation. Would anyone have come out of Jacksonville or Oakland unscathed in the last 5 years or so? I kind of doubt it.

 

[Ramhusker]

Meanwhile back at the ranch, at the end of the day, you can't draft a stupid QB in today's NFL. If he is a screw-up off the field, he most likely isn't going to be a stellar performer when it comes to reading NFL Ds and leading a team to success.

 

[Elmgrovegnome]

I don't own a company, just ascended quickly to manage my department. Over and around much older people I might add.

I was just refuting your claim about younger people being generally more lazy and entitled....I've encountered that in just as many "older" people as I have "younger". But either way, at the end of the day people will do what you allow them to do.

And as Jrry alluded to, this is a learned behavior. Parenting is a form of leadership, and just like leadership in the work place, not all who take it on are qualified to do so. That leads to all kinds of issues.

When I came in to a leadership role in my department, there was one person younger than 30 years old. She ended up finding another job. The other 14 or so people? All either terminated or encouraged to find another job (legally of course). They were all over 40 years old, and they were all entitled/lazy - but I don't fault them for that. They had horrific leadership for YEARS.

I agree with all that you have said about leadership and also dead weight. Having someon on a job too many years can lead to coasting, especially with poor leadership.

Maybe management practices are not as good as they used to be. I know in big corporations, firing people is as difficult as evicting someone. I know part of it is that the hiring process uses excess resources thus is a money drain, so getting people to stick is advocated. Fear of litigation is also a factor.

Having so much access to information hurts too. It causes distraction. It also can educate how much you can get away with at work. If Susie notices her friends posting on Facebook while at work, then she is more inclined to do the same. I know a two guys that played on line games while at work. Both were found out after a few years and were let go and given sevance packages. As a sole proprietor I just fire them. I don't get it but I know that overseeing state employees was frustrating because the state is terrified of having to fire people. People who realize it just abuse it.

But back to the Generation thing. Jrry is right it is a Generalization. The generation from the 60s and 70s were the peace love drugs generation, but that doesn't mean everyone participated in things that built that reputation.

 

[Elmgrovegnome]

Meanwhile back at the ranch, at the end of the day, you can't draft a stupid QB in today's NFL. If he is a screw-up off the field, he most likely isn't going to be a stellar performer when it comes to reading NFL Ds and leading a team to success.

I tend to agree with this. The trouble is when you have a guy who comes across as being accomplished on the field and a fool off of it, especially at a tough position like QB. I usually prefer high character types because they are smart enough to get it. If a guy doesnt realize what is at stake during his college career I have to wonder how smart he is and if he will ever start to take things seriously. How does DGB do the things he did without realizing it could be costing him millions? Doesn't sound too smart to me.

I love Winston's ability on the field and scratch my head at his off field antics. When he has millions in his pocket, does he become more of the knucklehead he is off the field or more the Knowledgable leader he is on the field? Cowherd said that players off field traits are who they really are and money only will amplify those off field traits. Showing up at the combine out of shape reflects who he really is.

I still think you have to take a chance on Winston because he is too good on the field and every team needs a very good QB to compete, but he sure is making his NFL success seem less certain.

 

[jrry32]

I tend to agree with this. The trouble is when you have a guy who comes across as being accomplished on the field and a fool off of it, especially at a tough position like QB. I usually prefer high character types because they are smart enough to get it. If a guy doesnt realize what is at stake during his college career I have to wonder how smart he is and if he will ever start to take things seriously. How does DGB do the things he did without realizing it could be costing him millions? Doesn't sound too smart to me.

I love Winston's ability on the field and scratch my head at his off field antics. When he has millions in his pocket, does he become more of the knucklehead he is off the field or more the Knowledgable leader he is on the field? Cowherd said that players off field traits are who they really are and money only will amplify those off field traits. Showing up at the combine out of shape reflects who he really is.

I still think you have to take a chance on Winston because he is too good on the field and every team needs a very good QB to compete, but he sure is making his NFL success seem less certain.

Who came to the Combine out of shape? Certainly not Winston.

Cowherd's opinion doesn't mean dick to me. But that's just my opinion, of course.

Some guys mature, some guys don't. That's the risk you take. But you take it with a lot of players each year...because there are a lot of guys who act out that don't get press or the program keeps it under wraps.