Fatal police shooting in Missouri sparks protests

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rhinobean

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Hope they don't try to spin this to make it look like self defense/justified use of deadly force. Don't think that's gonna fly! Bringing up possible robbery suspect has no bearing on whether multiple shots to the dead man's body were needed or warrented! A 40 calber is a good take down weapon!
 

MerlinJones

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I don't think they're (Ferguson PD) trying to establish justification for the shooting with the video.
As I understand it, they had to release the video by law. I can see why some may question the timing of it's release though.

I think that if it is Brown in the video (and I believe it is) it does give some possible insight into his state of mind at the time of incident that led to his shooting.

Unfortunately in this case it seems that every witness (police and civilian) has an agenda they're pursuing so I don't know that we'll ever know the entire series of events as they actually happened.

Honestly, I still can't believe the Ferguson police don't have in-car cameras.
 

Thordaddy

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I think the good people of Ferguson might want to ask themselves ,"would you like to live in a town fill of people like those who are l
Hope they don't try to spin this to make it look like self defense/justified use of deadly force. Don't think that's gonna fly! Bringing up possible robbery suspect has no bearing on whether multiple shots to the dead man's body were needed or warrented! A 40 calber is a good take down weapon!

Yeah, they will, and they aught to at least do it to the extent that they don't let it just look like a hunting trip, FWIW this looks like both parties contributed and one got way excessive in hies response.
If the kid was on his muscle and if he did attack the cop in his car ,it justifies a use of force,but from there if the cop was outnumbered a modicum of deadly force could be justified, but as far as continuing to fire after the kid was retreating ,no I completely agree the truth and the whole truth needs to be served .
I believe there will be a jury trial, but I doubt it's 1st degree and if it's not (which I can't see getting a conviction on) then it could be a loss in court when a lesser charge is warranted and would be much more provable,I'll leave it to more astute legal scolars as to whether a jury could vote on a lesser charge.

I want justice done and I don't think turning a kid who strong arm robs c-stores and attacks cops in their cars turned into a martyr is,unfortunately that's exactly what some of the "vehicle to power people" want and are assuming propagating.
 

rhinobean

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Shouldn't be 1st degree! 2nd most likely. Bad situation, for sure! Idiot looters from out of the area need to be thrown in jail for as long as they can be! Hate that the area has to endure this stupidity.
 

bluecoconuts

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First degree murder requires malice aforethought, it wouldn't qualify. 2nd degree could be pushed if it goes that far (and I say this having no real idea what's going on due to the difficulty of following from overseas), because that would be murder without leaving with the intent to kill someone, where manslaughter is generally reserved for accidents. Of course with more details things can change, but from what I hear maybe 2nd.

Also shooting him on the ground at most would be damaging a crime scene or something similar, usually it doesn't really change much in terms of the degrees of murder.
 

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GreeneCounty

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  • Thread Starter Thread Starter
  • #48
The whole city of Ferguson looks like a dumbass to me.

No excuse to loot and act like idiots regardless of what the police did wrong - if they even did. The US has a court system for a reason.

A bunch of people are acting like this kid was somehow picked out randomly. He certainly put himself in harms way, that's on him.
agree. I meant Jay was dumb in backing off the force to keep peace.
 

Elmgrovegnome

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Shooting someone who's unarmed and running away is the issue! Looting is stupid as it denigrates the whole community! Hope they get this right so that there's no doubt as to who's at fault! Too many cops have a god complex and shouldn't be cops! IMO!

Some cops get scared too and lose it. I dont know what happened in St. Louis, but I have spoken to a cop in South Chicago, years ago and he said he was scared every day he went to work and needed to get a different job. The guy was real big and afro American. He didn't look like he would scare easily. He said they have trouble getting and keeping police officers in that area and so he took the job becuase the pay was good and the needed a good job. I wonder if a guy like that was confronted with a riot and the rioters were showing no fear, or aggression, how he would react.
 

Thordaddy

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Some cops get scared too and lose it. I dont know what happened in St. Louis, but I have spoken to a cop in South Chicago, years ago and he said he was scared every day he went to work and needed to get a different job. The guy was real big and afro American. He didn't look like he would scare easily. He said they have trouble getting and keeping police officers in that area and so he took the job becuase the pay was good and the needed a good job. I wonder if a guy like that was confronted with a riot and the rioters were showing no fear, or aggression, how he would react.

Of course they get scared ,if they don't they are probably contributors to the problem,your example guy if he's scared from the first minute of the day does need something ,a different outlook or another job.

I owned a business half a block from ground zero for late night boozers in the worst part of town to congregate and continue any ill feelings coming from the bars,it was bad enough that the city council asked him to close during what was the independent operator's most lucrative shift,he fed cops for free all the time and he and I were friends so I spent a lot of time around his place and FWIW I saw IT ALL,talked to all the cops who came in,the local NAACP rep. spent a great deal of his time instructing people to allege charges for harassment and or abuse of power regardless what the truth was,to do it every time the police interceded, so the police here are instructed to stand down with force until the last moment and that means surrounded by hostiles to where if they want to rush you, you are going down. And it doesn't matter if it's a white cop or a black one,if he's black he's seen to be on the side of the hated whites so they get called Toms and house N's,the people they deal with hate period

That whole spiel in no way justifies a murder,it goes to your point they are scared and damned well should be they are tasked with doing a job and are expected to be super human automatons ,I wouldn't last in the job,and those that do can only stay objective through Herculean effort .

We have a terrible race problem in this country,and I am a loss to know how to solve it,the only people who can are looting and listening to people like Sharpton encourage it,I think if I saw Sharpton preaching " no justice no peace " I'd be hard pressed not to take him in for inciting to riot,that BTW is a quote from the past week, Again though when you look beyond the surface you know he's proposing a "solution" to a problem that isn't imaginary,it's real and at this moment I think the best anyone can do is try not to be a part of the problem themselves and pray for the future to be better,it's sad,downright depressing.
When I was a kid I looked up to the Chief of police and the sheriff,all the police for that matter,I'm glad I did ,I can't imagine what it would be like to hate the very people who were tasked with my security,it must be a desperate ugly feeling.
 

snackdaddy

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I work in a prison. But I don't have a fear for my safety in there. Maybe I should, but I don't. The difference between working in a prison and working on the streets is, in prison you know who the bad guys are. On the streets, it could be anybody. I don't envy a cops job. They have to make a life or death decision with half a second to determine the course of action. If it goes wrong like this one, they could pay for it the rest of their lives. Not a job I would want.
 

CGI_Ram

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I work in a prison. But I don't have a fear for my safety in there. Maybe I should, but I don't. The difference between working in a prison and working on the streets is, in prison you know who the bad guys are. On the streets, it could be anybody. I don't envy a cops job. They have to make a life or death decision with half a second to determine the course of action. If it goes wrong like this one, they could pay for it the rest of their lives. Not a job I would want.

I think that's what disappoints me when people criticize the police.

These men and women are put in bad situations. People want to put their decision making under the microscope like they have the benefit of instant replay.

You want to mess with the law? Stop blaming the police when something goes wrong then.
 

LesBaker

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I work in a prison. But I don't have a fear for my safety in there. Maybe I should, but I don't. The difference between working in a prison and working on the streets is, in prison you know who the bad guys are. On the streets, it could be anybody. I don't envy a cops job. They have to make a life or death decision with half a second to determine the course of action. If it goes wrong like this one, they could pay for it the rest of their lives. Not a job I would want.

You've got the snacks, nobody's gonna mess with you.
 

Elmgrovegnome

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I think that's what disappoints me when people criticize the police.

These men and women are put in bad situations. People want to put their decision making under the microscope like they have the benefit of instant replay.

You want to mess with the law? Stop blaming the police when something goes wrong then.

That is my take on it too. Criminals make a conscious decision to break the law and then get angry when it comes back on them. That is ridiculous. If that kid was near a riot and trying to block cars from going down the street........then was told to get on the sidewalk and off the street.....then he should have. Instead he challenged the officer? Disregarded his command? Maybe even went after him? Maybe the kid didnt deserve to die, I dont know what really happened but at one point he made a conscious decision to break the law in the presence of an officer telling him not to............It all goes wrong after that.


I own a piece of property that is zoned industrial. It is a big hole that I use to fill. I target shoot out there too. Once I took a guy out with me and he was shooting the Glock and just wasting rounds. He was unloading clips as fast as he could. I told him to knock it off but he continued. Sure enough the cops showed up and asked me what I was doing. I told him it was my land, and it was appropriately zoned for me to shoot my guns there. Plus it is surrounded by hillside on three sides. The neighbors lived a safe distance away and I was not hurting anyone. He said there was a complaint and that I was wrong about the zoning. I assured him that I was not wrong. Either way he said " I have no choice but to ask you to stand down and put your weapons away and dont shoot here again, until I can investigate further."

Now I knew I was in my legal rights. I knew he was wrong. I knew an injustice was being done to me. I could have told him to leave and continued to shoot. But as he said that he put his hand on his gun. Which let me know he was serious and maybe a little scared. It could have gotten ugly real fast if I didnt have the attitude that this guy is just trying to do his job and was probably not comfortable facing someone with a loaded gun on their waste and a few more guns in the back of the car where his buddy stood. So, I agreed and packed up and left even though we were not finished. A half hour later he called me and apologized and said I was right about all of it......and he also said he would explain things to the neighbor that complained.

If I had gotten all uppity about having my rights infringed on right there someone could have died. All it takes is a little common sense.
 

bluecoconuts

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That is my take on it too. Criminals make a conscious decision to break the law and then get angry when it comes back on them. That is ridiculous. If that kid was near a riot and trying to block cars from going down the street........then was told to get on the sidewalk and off the street.....then he should have. Instead he challenged the officer? Disregarded his command? Maybe even went after him? Maybe the kid didnt deserve to die, I dont know what really happened but at one point he made a conscious decision to break the law in the presence of an officer telling him not to............It all goes wrong after that.


I own a piece of property that is zoned industrial. It is a big hole that I use to fill. I target shoot out there too. Once I took a guy out with me and he was shooting the Glock and just wasting rounds. He was unloading clips as fast as he could. I told him to knock it off but he continued. Sure enough the cops showed up and asked me what I was doing. I told him it was my land, and it was appropriately zoned for me to shoot my guns there. Plus it is surrounded by hillside on three sides. The neighbors lived a safe distance away and I was not hurting anyone. He said there was a complaint and that I was wrong about the zoning. I assured him that I was not wrong. Either way he said " I have no choice but to ask you to stand down and put your weapons away and dont shoot here again, until I can investigate further."

Now I knew I was in my legal rights. I knew he was wrong. I knew an injustice was being done to me. I could have told him to leave and continued to shoot. But as he said that he put his hand on his gun. Which let me know he was serious and maybe a little scared. It could have gotten ugly real fast if I didnt have the attitude that this guy is just trying to do his job and was probably not comfortable facing someone with a loaded gun on their waste and a few more guns in the back of the car where his buddy stood. So, I agreed and packed up and left even though we were not finished. A half hour later he called me and apologized and said I was right about all of it......and he also said he would explain things to the neighbor that complained.

If I had gotten all uppity about having my rights infringed on right there someone could have died. All it takes is a little common sense.

Your actions are exaxtly what you should do. Too often I see people posting "advice" and it's all about filming the officer, giving them attitude, repeating that you know your rights, accusing them, etc. It's awful awful advice. Most police aren't looking to screw people over, hell it gives them more work. You being nice and packing up, he knew you did him a solid and he made sure he got himself informed so he could return the favor. If more people acted like you, we would have far far less of these situations.
 

Debacled

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For what its worth, the cop was checked into a noco hospital and treated for "swollen face" after the issue. Cover up? Possible, but it definitely looks like there was at least some kind of altercation.
 

RamzFanz

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There's still way to much misinformation being spread:

Brown and an accomplice committed strong arm robbery assaulting a small elderly clerk.

They then fled on foot and were walking down the middle of a street.

The cop stopped and asked or ordered the two to get out of the middle of the street. They refused to comply. We need to remember here that Brown knew he'd just robbed a store.

According to the cop and a friend of the cop he stopped when they refused and reversed back to them. He says he tried to exit his car twice and they slammed the door shut. He says Brown ten assaulted him and went for his gun. It appears he was in fact injured.

He then says he shot Brown from the car during the struggle. Brown backed off, his accomplice ran, the cop exited the car and Brown said the cop wouldn't shoot and rushed him at which time the cop fired several rounds killing him.

Brown's friend was also at the robbery. That's why I refer to him as the accomplice. His friend says the door wasn't slammed shut but bounced off them. He says the cop, while sitting, reached through the window and choked 6'4" Brown. I find that hard to believe. He then says that the cop tried to pull the 300 lb brown through the window of the car into the cops lap. That's just not realistic in any way.

The accomplice never mentioned they were fleeing a robbery until the video came out.

There is a video on youtube where you can hear witnesses discussing the event saying Brown kept charging the cop. This matches what the cops friend said. This also matches what the cop said.

That's all I know. However, at this point, I would say the scales are tipping toward Brown attacking the cop.
 

Elmgrovegnome

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There is a video on youtube where you can hear witnesses discussing the event saying Brown kept charging the cop. This matches what the cops friend said. This also matches what the cop said.

This is starting to sound like what really happened. Or did they bribe the witnesses?