Browns need to make a Jimmy Garoppolo trade happen

[CGI_Ram]

I don't know... Garoppolo feels like fools gold to me. Cassel... Mallet... Just another Patriots QB destined to show his true colors outside of their organization?

http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/news/h...-need-to-make-a-jimmy-garoppolo-trade-happen/

The only thing more aggravating than the Tony Romo rumors floating around the NFL this offseason are the Jimmy Garoppolo trade rumors. One minute he’s a sure bet to be traded, the next minute the Patriots might end up keeping him and all of a sudden there’s chatter he could fetch the top overall pick. Wild how that works!

The clear-cut leader in the Garoppolo sweepstakes is the team with the top-overall pick, the one and only Cleveland Browns, a quarterback-desperate team with a pile of picks available for negotiations.

Let’s look at what needs to happen in order for the Browns to acquire Garoppolo.

According to Mary Kay Cabot of Cleveland.com, the Patriots are going to require a first-round pick in exchange for Garoppolo. This jibes with what has been the general chatter for a while now. The Patriots want a first-rounder for their former second-round pick (with three years of investment in terms of training). The Browns have two of them, possessing the No. 1 overall pick and the No. 12 overall pick.

Cleveland also holds the No. 34 overall pick but apparently that’s not enough to make it work. (It should be, but that’s another argument.)

Cabot actually believes it might take MORE to get Garoppolo.

I believe it will take the No. 12 pick to acquire him, and possibly more. The trading window officially opens March 9, but unofficial talks will take place before then. If Belichick doesn’t receive a first-round offer right away, he can hang onto Garoppolo until draft day and try to drive up the price.

Draft day gets tricky, though. Let’s assume there are five teams who would realistically be willing to trade for Jimmy G: the Browns, the 49ers, the Bears, the Jetsand the Bills.

Let’s rule out Belichick trading Garoppolo in the divsion to the Jets or the Bills. Let’s also assume if he’s willing to send Garoppolo to either Buffalo or New York, both teams he plays twice a year, then it means he believes Garoppolo is going to flame out. Belichick isn’t handing the Jets or Bills a franchise quarterback regardless of the price.

So that leaves three teams. And this is where the leverage gets really tricky. Both the Bears and 49ers are going to be looking for long-term solutions at quarterback and both are expected to release their respective veteran starters (Jay Cutler and Colin Kaepernick).

But both teams are potential fits for other veterans. Tony Romo went to the same college (Eastern Illinois) as Bears GM Ryan Pace (which is also the same college Garoppolo went to!) and could be a fit in Chicago, although it’s a rebuilding team and he might not want to wait. Kyle Shanahan has previously coached Kirk Cousins and Cutler. Neither is guaranteed to be available come free agency, but both could be a fit for the 49ers if they want to go in a different direction than the top of the draft.

In other words, free agency is going to drastically dictate what happens with a Garoppolo trade. If the 49ers and Bears sign a veteran who can start (include Mike Glennon on that list, as well) then all of a sudden Belichick’s leverage with Cleveland could disappear.

This could also go in the total opposite direction. Cabot reports that Shanahan coveted Garoppolo coming out of Eastern Illinois when coaching the Browns in 2014, but Cleveland took Johnny Manziel. Whoops.

Kyle Shanahan, the new 49ers head coach, loved Garoppolo coming out of Eastern Illinois in 2014 when he was with Cleveland, but the Browns opted for Johnny Manziel instead.

Shanahan has the No. 2 and No. 34 overall picks and the second-most cap space in the NFL at almost $79 million. Quarterbacks love to play for Shanahan because of his QB-friendly scheme.

If San Francisco and Chicago don’t have an immediate or long-term answer at quarterback by the time the draft comes around, Belichick could be swimming in leverage with those teams. Cleveland might want to offer the No. 12 pick and he might be able to laugh about it, because he can threaten the Browns with San Francisco or Chicago trading their top pick.

This is all hypothetical, of course. The problem with giving up a top-five pick for Garoppolo is his contract. Both rookies and Garoppolo are unknown by default, but unlike a rookie, Garoppolo isn’t going to be on a cost-controlled contract for four years (plus a fifth-year option).

He’s going to play one season and then whoever acquires him will immediately be required to make a decision on an expensive, long-term contract. If he’s the guy, great. If he puts you in a position like the Redskins are in with Kirk Cousins, well, then you need to spend $45 million over the next two years to decide if he’s the right answer.

To sum up, if the Browns want to acquire Jimmy Garoppolo for a reasonable price and have him be the savior of Cleveland football, they need a bunch of other quarterback-needy teams go out in free agency and sign players, then have the Patriots take less than they normally would in a trade and then have Garoppolo agree to a long-term contract in Clevleand.

 

[JackDRams]

Wonder what sorry franchise is gonna have to learn he's nothing special. Hope it's not the Browns, because that means the Patriots fleeced them for a first round pick, or more.

 

[Boston Ram]

Who ever gets him is getting a great QB. This kid is the real deal. Quick release, can read the defense at the line and makes great decisions.

Mallet was a tool box in college and remains such. Cassell was never great.

This is a player that had the tools and head coming out of college. Was only a 2nd rounder because of the school.

My only concern is can he stay healthy and that is only a concern because he has not done it.

I'm rooting for the kid.

 

[Tron]

I'm on the fence. I liked him coming out and wanted the Rams to get him in the 2nd. He isn't a mid-late round prospect. He has had a few years to learn under Brady. If I was the Browns I would trade the 12th overall for him. I see no other QB in this draft as good as him. He's not a rookie. They either draft a shitty QB early who needs a lot of time to develop or trade for a guy who was a high round pick and studied under Brady. Id do it if the Browns. His release always reminded me of Warners. To down grade him just because he is bradys backup is kind of not right. Guy has the stuff.

 

[DCH]

Who ever gets him is getting a great QB. This kid is the real deal. Quick release, can read the defense at the line and makes great decisions.

Mallet was a tool box in college and remains such. Cassell was never great.

This is a player that had the tools and head coming out of college. Was only a 2nd rounder because of the school.

My only concern is can he stay healthy and that is only a concern because he has not done it.

I'm rooting for the kid.

Agreed. This ain't flash-in-the-pan Cassel or never-was Mallett. Cassel's first 5 games saw a 3 to 4 TD to INT ratio. Garoppolo's first 2 games saw 4 TDs and zero INTs.

The kid is good. Really good. I loved him for the Rams when he came out of Eastern Illinois, and in the small chance he's gotten to play, he's played like a top-tier QB.

Mallett I never understood. Big arm, no accuracy, feet of lead. Garoppolo is the QB mold people should be looking for - quality (but not huge) arm, great touch, great accuracy, high football IQ and good pocket presence.

 

[OldSchool]

If you're going to roll the dice on an untested QB at least make it a cost controlled one. You're going to have to resign Garapollo which would make it a bigger gamble than spending the 12th or 32nd pick on a rookie.

 

[jrry32]

What differentiates Garoppolo from Matt Flynn or A.J. McCarron? This is the sort of deal that blows up in the acquiring team's face 75% of the time. The problem with this trade is that you can't just trade a pick for Garoppolo. You have to trade a pick AND sign him to a huge extension. It's a double whammy if you get it wrong.

The guy played with a stacked deck this year. He played behind top tier protection, he played in a system that is incredible at scheming WRs open, and he played on the Super Bowl champions (clearly had talent). Plus, he got injured before teams had enough film to adjust to his style of play.

Coming out of college, my notes on the kid were that he has a quick release, is very accurate within 10-15 yards, throws a great ball when hitting his initial read, and has functional mobility in the pocket. My concerns with him were that he's a weaker-armed QB whose deeper throws tend to float, his accuracy wanes the further down the field he goes, he doesn't feel pressure well and drops his eyes when he gets nervous, and his placement and timing got noticeably worse as he was forced to progress through reads.

To this point, he hasn't done anything that changes my view of him. He's a great fit for the Patriots offense because of the nature of their system and level of protection. But I think he'll struggle mightily if you put him on a team with a very different system and less reliable protection. I think he's a particularly bad fit in Cleveland. Hue Jackson's offense is vertically aggressive, and the Browns protection stunk in 2016.

Garoppolo makes sense in a system like Asshole Face's, Andy Reid's, or Adam Gase's.

As I sit here, I wonder why Brett Hundley doesn't get any love. Green Bay's backup QBs have historically been the best bet in regards to backup QB trades (going back to the Holmgren era). Hundley has franchise QB physical tools. And Hundley has shown improvement in key areas.

If I were a team in need of a QB, I'd be far more likely to trade a 3rd for Brett Hundley (especially considering you'll have him on his rookie QB for a couple of years) than a 1st/early 2nd for Garoppolo.

 

[DCH]

Part of it is that Garoppolo, in theory at least, has acclimated himself to the NFL's size, speed and schemes. A rookie is going to require a couple of years getting up to speed in the NFL - with a guy like Garoppolo, you have someone who is on par talent-wise with someone like Watson or Kizer but who has been taught how to play at the NFL level.

You're basically fast-forwarding the rookie learning process. Yes, you're coming in at the end of the contract, but the reasoning would be that by the time Watson is ready to play at Garoppolo's level, he'd also be nearing the end of his rookie contract, and in the interim you'd have wasted a few years with a QB learning on the job.

It's (again, theoretically) like being able to manufacture the Aaron Rodgers situation - a QB who has learned behind a future HOF QB, who wasn't thrown into the fire immediately to pick up bad habits, and who was afforded the time and practice reps necessary to acclimate a young quarterback to the NFL.

 

[TheDYVKX]

Whether or not it's the right move for the Browns, I want them to do it. If only because that way the 49ers can't get Myles Garrett at all.

 

[DCH]

Whether or not it's the right move for the Browns, I want them to do it. If only because that way the 49ers can't get Myles Garrett at all.

There's no way the Browns don't take Garrett #1 overall. Even if they don't trade for a QB, Garrett is the only player worthy of #1 and they have a huge need.

 

[TheDYVKX]

There's no way the Browns don't take Garrett #1 overall. Even if they don't trade for a QB, Garrett is the only player worthy of #1 and they have a huge need.

Don't underestimate the Browns.

 

[Picked4td]

The browns arent a QB a way. Unless he becomes a HoFer, I think its dumb to trade premium picks for such an uncertainty when your roster is so talent ridden. Id ride out another bad season and continue to draft best player available

 

[DCH]

The browns arent a QB a way. Unless he becomes a HoFer, I think its dumb to trade premium picks for such an uncertainty when your roster is so talent ridden. Id ride out another bad season and continue to draft best player available

They do have a shit-ton of cap space, a franchise LT, an overall pretty good O-line, Barnidge and Pryor. Their offense may actually be a QB away from being top half of the league. Better, maybe, if Gordon ever gets his shit together.

 

[OldSchool]

All the speculation about the Browns trading for Jimmy ignore one simple thing that eliminates them from consideration. One simple word, Moneyball! Paul DePodesta was brought over from baseball to run the Browns. The very concept of trading for an unproven QB and signing him to a big contract is the antithesis to Moneyball.

 

[Boston Ram]

What differentiates Garoppolo from Matt Flynn or A.J. McCarron? This is the sort of deal that blows up in the acquiring team's face 75% of the time. The problem with this trade is that you can't just trade a pick for Garoppolo. You have to trade a pick AND sign him to a huge extension. It's a double whammy if you get it wrong.

The guy played with a stacked deck this year. He played behind top tier protection, he played in a system that is incredible at scheming WRs open, and he played on the Super Bowl champions (clearly had talent). Plus, he got injured before teams had enough film to adjust to his style of play.

Coming out of college, my notes on the kid were that he has a quick release, is very accurate within 10-15 yards, throws a great ball when hitting his initial read, and has functional mobility in the pocket. My concerns with him were that he's a weaker-armed QB whose deeper throws tend to float, his accuracy wanes the further down the field he goes, he doesn't feel pressure well and drops his eyes when he gets nervous, and his placement and timing got noticeably worse as he was forced to progress through reads.

To this point, he hasn't done anything that changes my view of him. He's a great fit for the Patriots offense because of the nature of their system and level of protection. But I think he'll struggle mightily if you put him on a team with a very different system and less reliable protection. I think he's a particularly bad fit in Cleveland. Hue Jackson's offense is vertically aggressive, and the Browns protection stunk in 2016.

Garoppolo makes sense in a system like Asshole Face's, Andy Reid's, or Adam Gase's.

As I sit here, I wonder why Brett Hundley doesn't get any love. Green Bay's backup QBs have historically been the best bet in regards to backup QB trades (going back to the Holmgren era). Hundley has franchise QB physical tools. And Hundley has shown improvement in key areas.

If I were a team in need of a QB, I'd be far more likely to trade a 3rd for Brett Hundley (especially considering you'll have him on his rookie QB for a couple of years) than a 1st/early 2nd for Garoppolo.

I dont understand post like this. Sure he had a stacked deck this year but so did Jacoby Brissett this year for 2 games and was not even close to effective at Garoppolo. Even with the talent the kid got the job done. Based on the logic about talent and scheme Brissett should of had the same results.

I am aware of your notes from college, you and I had some spirited debates on RRF about him lol. That being said, he is a different player now.

Not sure why your view has not changed. Saying he is a great fit for the Patriots system....what does that even mean? He can only play for McDaniels type offense? As for level of protection, the Patriots oline was a mess early in the year. In 3 years, Garoppolo has not thrown a pick in 93 regular season attempts. In preseason he has only thrown 3 in 3 years. In 2016 he got rid of the ball faster than any other QB in the NFL and had one of the highest QB ratings against the blitz. Ignore these numbers if you must but if you watched any of his game this year you have to admit he passed the eye ball test. Putting him in the McCarron or Flynn bucket is severely underselling him IMO.

As for Hundley, why would GB offer him for anything? He is a perfect backup right now for them and insurance plan if something happened to Rodgers. Difference here is Garoppolo is available and Hundley is not. Nobody is underselling Hundley, he is just not available and GB would be crazy to give him up at this point.......Plus Hundley can only play in a McCarthy offense

 

[DCH]

Hundley has two years under his rookie contract. Thus, the Packers have no incentive to trade him.
Garoppolo will be a FA after this year, meaning if the Patriots are ever going to trade him, it'll be now.
The contract status is what makes him available.

Also, Hundley is, for his career, 2 for 10 for 17 yards with a pick and a fumble. Garoppolo has successfully driven a team to two victories with a pretty damned impressive performance each time.

 

[OldSchool]

The difference between Garapollo and Hundley is there isn't a decent 3rd QB behind Hundley. I too would rather have Hundley but there is no way the Packers make him available.

 

[jrry32]

I dont understand post like this. Sure he had a stacked deck this year but so did Jacoby Brissett this year for 2 games and was not even close to effective at Garoppolo. Even with the talent the kid got the job done. Based on the logic about talent and scheme Brissett should of had the same results.

This is atrocious logic, Boston. Garoppolo is in his third year in the NFL, all in that system. Brissett is a developmental rookie. Garoppolo prepped all off-season and throughout the preseason to start the first four games of the season. Brissett wasn't supposed to see the field. Let's not sit here and pretend that it's reasonable to expect a developmental rookie to play as well as a third-year veteran QB.

Jimmy Garoppolo played much of the Week 17 game his rookie year (whereas Brissett had to step in for Weeks 2 through 4). Garoppolo looked worse than Brissett did.

I am aware of your notes from college, you and I had some spirited debates on RRF about him lol. That being said, he is a different player now.

I don't see a different player.

As for level of protection, the Patriots oline was a mess early in the year. In 3 years, Garoppolo has not thrown a pick in 93 regular season attempts. In preseason he has only thrown 3 in 3 years. In 2016 he got rid of the ball faster than any other QB in the NFL and had one of the highest QB ratings against the blitz. Ignore these numbers if you must but if you watched any of his game this year you have to admit he passed the eye ball test. Putting him in the McCarron or Flynn bucket is severely underselling him IMO.

Bull. A poster on another forum posted every singe pass that Garoppolo threw and tallied up how often he was pressured. Here are the results:
Game #1

Game totals:
Average snap to release time: 2.23 seconds
Total plays: 39
2 sacks
4 hurries
7 hits (including 2 runs)
Knocked down 5 times
Pressure % per drop back: 15.4% or close to 1 pressure every 7 drop-backs.

Game #2

Average snap to release time: 2.43
Total pass plays: 30
1 sack
6 Hurries
6 hits
knocked down 6 times
Pressure % per drop back: 23.3%

I watched every single snap that Garoppolo took. He hasn't done enough to pass the eye test for me. I don't see anything that differentiates him from Flynn and McCarron. He's a tad more talented than both, but you're taking the same risk with him that you would have taken on Flynn and will have to take on McCarron. He's no more proven than either.

And I also am going to point out that he got the ball out quickly because that's how the offense is designed to work.

Not sure why your view has not changed. Saying he is a great fit for the Patriots system....what does that even mean? He can only play for McDaniels type offense?

It means exactly what it says. He's a great fit for what NE does. That offense revolves around getting the ball out quickly, throwing on time and in rhythm, and stretching the field horizontally. It's an offense that is built upon short, timing patterns and capitalizing down the field when the defense makes a mistake.

Considering I gave you three other systems that I think he would fit in, it's pretty clear that I don't think he ONLY can fit in NE's E-P system. But I do think it's the system best designed for his skill-set.

As for Hundley, why would GB offer him for anything? He is a perfect backup right now for them and insurance plan if something happened to Rodgers. Difference here is Garoppolo is available and Hundley is not. Nobody is underselling Hundley, he is just not available and GB would be crazy to give him up at this point.......Plus Hundley can only play in a McCarthy offense

Why not? Rodgers isn't going anywhere. If they can get a pick that's higher than what they spent on Hundley, there's no reason not to trade him.

 

[dieterbrock]

Difference between Garapolo and Mallet/Cassell/Flynn is that that JG was drafted in the 2nd round, and he is progressing worthy of his draft status. Flynn was a one game wonder who didn't even start a full season, and Cassell never even started in college.

 

[Boston Ram]

This is atrocious logic, Boston. Garoppolo is in his third year in the NFL, all in that system. Brissett is a developmental rookie. Garoppolo prepped all off-season and throughout the preseason to start the first four games of the season. Brissett wasn't supposed to see the field. Let's not sit here and pretend that it's reasonable to expect a developmental rookie to play as well as a third-year veteran QB.

Jimmy Garoppolo played much of the Week 17 game his rookie year (whereas Brissett had to step in for Weeks 2 through 4). Garoppolo looked worse than Brissett did.



I don't see a different player.



Bull. A poster on another forum posted every singe pass that Garoppolo threw and tallied up how often he was pressured. Here are the results:
Game #1


Game #2


I watched every single snap that Garoppolo took. He hasn't done enough to pass the eye test for me. I don't see anything that differentiates him from Flynn and McCarron. He's a tad more talented than both, but you're taking the same risk with him that you would have taken on Flynn and will have to take on McCarron. He's no more proven than either.

And I also am going to point out that he got the ball out quickly because that's how the offense is designed to work.



It means exactly what it says. He's a great fit for what NE does. That offense revolves around getting the ball out quickly, throwing on time and in rhythm, and stretching the field horizontally. It's an offense that is built upon short, timing patterns and capitalizing down the field when the defense makes a mistake.

Considering I gave you three other systems that I think he would fit in, it's pretty clear that I don't think he ONLY can fit in NE's E-P system. But I do think it's the system best designed for his skill-set.



Why not? Rodgers isn't going anywhere. If they can get a pick that's higher than what they spent on Hundley, there's no reason not to trade him.

Clearly there is not way to fully respond to this. You have your opinion. I call bull on some of your analysis though. You call bull on the oline and reference another poster (which makes me question if you watched him or relying on others info) who's release numbers are incorrect.
http://m.weei.com/sports/feed/blog/...-showcases-quick-release-upset-over-cardinals
He avoided hits by getting rid of the ball and manipulating the pocket.
How you dont see a different player than the college player tells me you did not watch him in college or the NFL because he is not the same player.
If you really watched every snap this year and you think he is a "tad" better than Flynn and McCarron then there is nothing left to say. Im sorry but he is much better than those players and its not close.

As for Hundley, again I hold on to a player like him. If you think he can play you keep him as insurance in case Rodgers gets hurt. He is more valuable to GB as a viable backup then a 3rd round gamble IMO.